Editorials Lucha Libre

Lucha Indie Fantasy Draft, Part II

Four guys try to do some lucha booking!

The second half of the fantasy draft is about to start. Just in case you forgot what we were doing from Part I:

  • It’s snake style draft of indie luchadors to create our own league style tournament, where everyone involved faces everyone else in single matches.
  • We’re taking Mexico focused luchadors. We’re not taking AAA or Penta or Fenix because we probably couldn’t get them even in a fictional universe, and we don’t end up really picking CMLL guys (spoiler).
  • RobViper has the first pick in the fifth round. We’re each ending up picking eight.

The fields so far:

RobViper: Black Taurus, Bandido, Tortuga Rafy, Fly Warrior
TKD: Flamita, Rey Horuz, Golden Magic, Daga
thecubsfan: Caifan, Jack Evans, Laredo Kid, Belial
Doradafan: Rey Escorpion, Aramis, Eterno, Rocky Lobo

Round 5: Pick 1 – RobViper picks GUERRERO MIXTICO

Seen Often In: CaraLucha
Recommend Match: w/Andy Boy vs Sky Man & Rayo Star vs Toxin Boy & Wassson in Kamicazes del Ring

RobViper: I’ll take Guerrero Mixtico with the caveat he’ll be re-gimmicked. I think he’s a super unknown flyer who can do stuff not many others can do. Him and Black Taurus in the ring together is just incredible to think about.

TKD: I like both of those picks. Cecilia was suggesting that I take Mixtico soon.

Round 5: Pick 2 – TKD picks CENTVRION

Seen Often In: XMW
Recommended Match: vs Metaleon in XMW

TKD: For my round 5, I’ll take
Centvrion. He should be able to bring yet more offense variety to my roster and
has shown over the years to be quite versatile.

Doradafan: Noo why you do this 🙁
Doradafan: I have to rethink now.

TKD: was that directed at Rob, me, or both? 🙂

Doradafan: You, really wanted Centurion next

TKD: Oops. 🙂

Doradafan: It’s all good, I have a backup plan.

Doradafan: Cubs can still ruin it tho

thecubsfan: Belial versus Centviron is the other 2016 lucha match got me to take Belial and would’ve gotten me to take Centvrion too if he’d been around.

Doradafan: I was debating leaving Eterno to TKD just so we get Flamita/Eterno. Actually if this wasn’t fantasy I 100% would do it

Round 5: Pick 3 – thecubsfan picks DRAZTICK BOY

Seen Often In: Dragon Gate, DTU
Recommended Match: w/Ronnie Mendoza vs Flamita & Johnny Idol in DTU

thecubsfan: For my pick, I’m taking Draztick Boy. This is heavily, maybe too heavily, on his performance in that elimination DTU match on their PPV. He’s always been enjoyable when DTU matches turn up, he looked outstanding in that one and I think the Dragon Gate trip is going to keep helping him improve. Giving him more singles match in this tournament will help too. He’s probably better than Belial as an undersized guy who can fly and do big moves, but not given as much credit because the DTU guys aren’t showing up on YouTube as much.

Doradafan: I like that pick a lot. I didn’t feel like getting all the old DTU kids and I wasn’t’ able to either since TKD picked Flamita. But it would have been pretty cool to have Flamita, Draztik Boy, Rocky Lobo and..

Round 5: Pick 4 – DoradaFan picks RONNIE MENDOZA/JINZO

Seen Often In: Dragon Gate, DTU, CWC
Recommended Match: vs Ultimo Ninja and DJZ in Martinez Promociones

Doradafan: Jinzo really grew on me this last year, and I feel like he’s developed his own style. A tournament like this would probably fit him very well!

Round 6: Pick 1 – DoradaFanpicks SATURNO

Seen Often In: Guadalajara indies, CaraLucha
Recent Matches: vs Skyman in CaraLucha

Doradafan: My other pick will be Saturno! He if anyone needs the exposure. He’ll be 26 this year and I would really love to see him get a chance in the major indie promotions soon. His match with Skyman in Caralucha was great!

TKD: Sorry Doradafan for spoiling all your plans. I had to pick Flamita first though.

TKD: I like Draztick Boy as a pick, probably undervalued across the board right now.

Round 6: Pick 2 – thecubsfan picks IMPOSIBLE

Seen Often In: IWRG, ELITE
Recommend Match: vs Relampago in IWRG

thecubsfan: I’m probably underrating the IWRG guys – the promotion has about the same volume of just ok matches as the CMLL Monday/Tuesday without as many highlights (though their peak stuff is better than those shows peak stuff for sure). There’s not the excitement to pick Black Terry or Trauma I or other people. I’m going fix that problem a little bit by taking the 2016 IWRG – my pick is Imposible. No one was better at working big title matches against a variety of opponents, some not particularly good. He had good matches with guys as different as Freelance and Heddi Karaoui, made Relampago look as good as he has in whole career. There’s a bit or two I wish he would do less frequently (we may need to bring along stairs for our shows), but he can work as a rudo or tecnico against anyone. The only disappointing thing about his 2016 was he did OK in ELITE, but didn’t end up going with Bandido/Golden Magic guys to get showcased outside of his home promotion. I can fix that here.

Doradafan: Thought of picking him as well, but I got Eterno instead. I’d love to see him against the guys on your squad
Doradafan: Especially vs. Belial or Draztik Boy

Round 6: Pick 3 – TKD picks RAYO STAR

Seen Often In: CARALUCHA
Recommended Match: vs Sky Man in CaraLucha

TKD: I’m going to pick Rayo Star. I may be going a bit high on him, but I like his offense as a mix of that of other guys who aren’t available. He’s young and probably a bit less flexible than others, and I get the feeling that he might need some guidance to get through matches with unfamiliar people, but the guys I have should be able to help him with that and get him valuable experience. But he’s shown that he is capable of a great+ match in the right circumstances. Plus he was involved in one of my favorite matches ever (Flamita / Rayo Star vs. Golden Magic / Eterno from the Christmas 2015 CaraLucha show), and I think that highlights his potential.

Doradafan: He’s got a lot of potential for sure! I’d say in two years he could be one of the best

RobViper: I have to think now because Imposible was my next pick.

RobViper: Centvrion was another guy I penciled in but didn’t think I’d get

RobViper: The thing with Centvrion is he doesn’t work as often as he used to and I feel he was peaking in 2015/early 2016. The Metaleon match from XMW was great but there’s nothing else I can pinpoint as a blowaway match.

thecubsfan: He’s wrestling on those (Nueva Pista) Arena Revolucion shows a fair bit, which I think must be Ultimo Guerrero trainees or something along those lines. Wish they were being taped.

RobViper: Going back to the Indystrongtibles… I’d rank them Arez, Belial & Impulso. Arez is underrated because he does too many stupid hardcore matches. But when he avoids that garbage he’s usually impressive. Belial’s stock dropped for me after the Virus match in February. He didn’t bring it.

RobViper: I feel like taking Turbo & Black Thunder is cheating because they aren’t regularly working any more unless it’s tiny shows we don’t know about.

RobViper: And I want X-Fly in any promotion I run but this singles format is not for him.

Round 6: Pick 4 – RobViper picks ASTURIANO

Seen Often In: Arena Puebla, Puebla indies
Recent Matches: w/Astro & Ultimo Dragoncito vs Espiritu Maligno, Mini Joker, Pierrothito from Arena Puebla

RobViper: So with my #6 I’m jailbreaking Asturiano from Puebla. He’s always deserved a shot and has the skill to hang with better guys from anywhere. He’s also experienced which is something lacking from my picks so far.

Round 7: Pick 1 – RobViper picks GEO

Seen Often In: IWRG, obscure Mexico City indies
Recommended Match: w/Enigma, Zenki, Hijo de Mascara Sagrada vs Vortiz, Skayde, Kanon, Cancer

RobViper: My #7 was supposed to be my #8 but I can’t decide who to choose for #7 so I’m either giving myself time or you guys can make the decision for me by stealing one of them… so my #8 moving to #7 is Geo. The limited stuff of his I’ve seen has been tremendous. Deep down I think he’s either Skayde’s son or Raziel’s kid. His style fits them perfectly and I can’t wait to see more of him. He’s my hidden gem.

RobViper: I want to tell you guys the list of 3 guys I am torn between but also don’t want to give them away in case you miss them. But I’ve written them down for later.

thecubsfan: I didn’t see Asturiano coming but that’s an interesting pick.

RobViper: 2 years ago my only pick from Puebla would have been Rey Apocalipsis and he’d have been top 3

TKD: Asturiano I think I had discounted because “CMLL”. But CMLL Puebla is as if it’s in its own universe. Good pick.

Round 7: Pick 2 – TKD picks AERO BOY

Seen Often In: DTU
Recommended Match: vs Black Terry

TKD: For my #7 I’ll take Aero Boy, with the proviso that he leave his hardcore stuff at home. With his broad experience (including some with my upper picks), he seems as reliable for giving at least a solid match consistently as any guy remaining that I’m considering.

Doradafan: Really like the Asturiano pick! The man deserves a chance like this

Doradafan: I don’t know about Aeroboy. I guess he’s decent aside from his extremas shit but I can’t remember a match when he’s really impressed me. I’d say he’s solid though

thecubsfan: I really liked the Aeroboy/Extreme Tiger match I saw last year,  though part of it was it saved an otherwise dire show.

Round 7: Pick 3 – thecubsfan picks BLACK TERRY

Seen Often In: IWRG, Lucha Memes
Recommended Match: Negro Navarro vs The Panther & Blue Panther, CMLL

thecubsfan: I also really liked his apuesta match last year, so I’ll take the other half of that, Black Terry. He’s looked good in featured masks as recently as Tuesday and probably will again in the title match. He’ll bring something different than adding another younger guy to the match and more variety than a Navarro. I mostly just want to see Jack and Terry react to each other.

Round 7: Pick 4 – DoradaFan picks KOMANDER

Seen Often In: Reynosa indies
Recommended Match: w/Angel-O vs Dulce & Chocolata and Perfil & Luminoso

Doradafan: I’ll take Komander for my 7th pick! Wow, what a shocker! He’s 18 now so the commission can’t argue! The things he can do on the ropes are just incredible, and I would mark out if he ever got on the big indies. He’s way too talented to never get out of his home arena

TKD: Aero Boy doesn’t stand out as much as others but — and this could be selection bias — it feels like there’s less downside/flexibility risk with him than with others I could pick, which makes it easier for me to feel comfortable keeping my possibilities broad for #8. Plus he has a few unusual things in his repertoire like the rolling casita that you don’t see from guys his age.

TKD: Komander for you wasn’t a matter of if, it was when. 🙂 Though if you had SOMEHOW had a change of heart or something I would have taken him.

Doradafan: Decided to pick him late since I didn’t think anyone else would. However I would not have minded at all if someone did, it would just have made it seem less biased from me 😛

Round 8: Pick 1 – DoradaFan picks METALEON

Seen Often In: ELITE
Recommended Match: w/Mr. Leo vs Tiger & Puma, XMW

Doradafan: My explanation for that is pretty simple. It was way too hard to decide who was the best of the like 30 guys I had in my mind. So I decided I want someone who does my favorite spot of all time (the one foot springboard rana from the apron). That gave me: Aerostar, is AAA, Luminoso, Torreon local that seems talented but I haven’t seen enough of. Rey Astral, amazing spots and talented but not a good enough worker/doesnt care about some matches and Metaleon! So Metaleon it is! He was impressive in Elite and some of his indy matches in 2016 was phenomenal!

Round 8: Pick 2 – thecubsfan picks ULTIMO NINJA

Seen Often In: Monterrey, ELITE
Recommend Match: w/Laredo Kid & Ninja Jr. vs Flamita, Golden Magic, Metaleon from Monterrey

thecubsfan: I’m going to make Ultimo Ninja my last pick. He had times where he looked great at times on Elite, and has been promising on indies – he was good in the short lived CaraLucha/DF vs Monterrey feud. I haven’t seen him as much in singles, but I think he’s worth a chance in a tournament like this.

Doradafan: It came down to him, Metaleon and another guy for me. Glad someone picked him anyway

TKD: I had a feeling Doradafan would snatch up Metaleon

Round 8: Pick 3 – TKD picks EXTREME TIGER

Seen Often In: ELITE, The Crash
Recommended Match: vs Mascara Dorada, from ELITE

TKD: I’ve mulled this over for a while, and I’m going with Extreme Tiger for my final pick. He seems to have become fairly consistently enjoyable over the last couple of years wherever he shows up. I think the turning point for me was his match vs. ACH at Chilanga Mask in March 2015. Plus, Extreme Tiger has a bunch of experience with a lot of my group, and I’m pretty confident that these guys wouldn’t make it simply more of what we’ve already seen. I kept trying to see if I could rationalize a different / less conservative pick, but this seemed to make too much sense to me in terms of cohesion.

Round 8: Pick 4 – RobViper picks TRITON

Seen Often In: CMLL, US Midwest indies
Recommended Match: w/Drone & The Panther vs Cuatrero, Forastero, Sanson from CMLL

RobViper: I will round out the picks with Triton. I don’t think CMLL even remembers he’s leaving and expect him to be on cards next week so I assume they won’t mind if I steal him for a mini round robin. He’s eager to prove he can succeed outside Mexico and looked great in his U.S. appearances last time.

(Editor’s Note: Triton was listed on CMLL’s cards.)

RobViper: Which means the 3 guys I kept pushing back on taking ended up not picked (Dinamic Black, Ciclon Ramirez Jr & Magia Blanca)

thecubsfan: Is there anyone else we’re going to get flak for leaving off?

Doradafan: Probably Garza Jr. but that’s just from certain people

Doradafan: Estudiante Jr. will be furious

TKD: Could see certain people wondering about LA Park but no one really built the rest of their roster for someone like him.

Thecubsfan: I don’t want to be in a bus for 3 weeks with LA Park, he will get too ornery.

TKD: The problem with LA Park in my mind is you could get a few great brawls out of him with the right people but it’d be a stretch to do it for 7 matches. This isn’t the format for him.

Here’s the final groups:

RobViper: Black Taurus, Bandido, Tortuga Rafy, Fly Warrior, Guerrero Mixtico, Asturiano, Geo, and Triton

TKD: Flamita, Rey Horuz, Golden Magic, Daga, Centvrion, Rayo Star, Aeroboy, and Extreme Tiger

thecubsfan: Caifan, Jack Evans, Laredo Kid, Belial, Draztick Boy, Imposible, Black Terry, and Ultimo Ninja

Doradafan: Rey Escorpion, Aramis, Eterno, Rocky Lobo, Ronnie Mendoza, Saturno, Komander, and Metaleon

Who did the best? Which tournament would you most like to see? Twitter poll below:

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